Strong! what some players are wanting to see is a completely even playing field. No advantages for either paying money for or allowing any usage of money earned by grinding or purchasing for years of playing.
This of course will never happen since andrew has already added money to buycraft. And you can see by the contracts that forum money is already purchasing spawn towns.
You are absolutely correct, there will always be rich and poor players in the game. And the poor will always complain the rich get richer. Mostly this is simply because the richer players tend to take the time to grind, stay away from lotto mostly, and manage their money carefully. The poor will typically be those that hang out, do very little work, and mismanage their money.
Six months from now, if not sooner, the complaints will begin about how it is unfair that the wealthy players have such an advantage.
I also agree with you that the idea of isr getting smaller as your island level grows is probably a good idea.
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It's far easier to get a lot of ECD with /isr than it was on main, or will be on city. Rich players on skyblock can easily use their wealth to buy things which increase their production, letting the rich become exponentially richer in a relatively short amount of time. Once you get to a certain point, you can earn 15k ECD an hour on skyblock with only a few minutes of effort. Even for new players on skyblock, they can earn an easy 7.5k ECD an hour by buying gold blocks from other players for half of their ISR. What this does is distort the distribution of money so that the rich players on skyblock will have a ridiculous amount of money you could never hope to earn without far more effort on city, casual skyblock players won't be as rich but still fairly wealthy, while people who don't play skyblock because they don't like it will be completely left behind. We should be able to earn just as much ECD on the "main" economy server - city - as we can earn on skyblock. Especially because of how easy it is to automate/AFK levels in skyblock.
When skyblock launched, people played main less and less so that this wasn't really an issue. But if ISR stays exactly the same when City launches, this WILL ruin the economy over time. Automating ways to earn AFK money on skyblock SHOULD NOT be the deciding factor in who the richest players are in City.
Another issue with ISR is that it made SBD effectively worthless after about a month. Other than buying random items from a few player shops, no one uses SBD in skyblock anymore. Everyone is trying to cash out of skyblock by trading away as much as they can for ECD. It's impossible to buy spawners in skyblock with SBD from other players now. It's near impossible to buy a significant amount of blocks for levels, like gold or iron, without spending ECD.
For these reasons, ISR is obviously harmful for both City and Skyblock, and should be modified, heavily nerfed or possibly removed. -
I hate to say it but regardless of how this goes, it will still be a mess.. There is way too much money out there. I was hoping to see it be a whole new experience regardless of new or old players.
People have already bought tons of ecd for city with usd.... Right from the go there will be millions pouring into the economy. My hope is that it all goes into the black hole of the forums for ranks and towns
People have millions saved in forum bank.... I was under the impression we were allowed to use this for forum stuff? ranks? towns?
Star tools appear to be a go as well..
At this point allowing ECD from Bank cant do any worse. I agree with everyone stating for it to be allowed for ranks and towns.. basically anything that can be be purchased through forums. Although I thought that was already the case from what andrew said in the beginning. I guess I mis-heard that. -
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Players will still trade materials for forums balance because they can use the forum balance to get ranks which include towns which effect property prices aka the economy or a side of the economy anyway.
So making forum bals for ranks and apps essentially is effecting the economy in a huge way.
I thought the reset was also to do with new biomes and the fact the old world couldn't update. If the world could have been update, no 'reset' would be happening anyway. So is it really a reset? Afterall, im sure we all remember the welcome message about main never resetting :3 -
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idkhowtoplay Custom Forum TitleBuilder ⛰️ Ex-EcoLegend ⚜️⚜️⚜️⚜️ Prestige ⭐ I ⭐ Premium Upgrade
There's a lot that I missed, so I'm going to reply and header each of these talking points.
Edit: Spoilers made for easier reading.
1) Conversion of ECD (Forum Bank) --> ECD (on City)
I now understand more completely what you mean by "intangible", however, it does not mean that we cannot deduce where the money came from. If a player typed in the command /isr, and soon after the money was added by AutoBank, with the comment "(AutoBank) Deposited from Server: skyblock", we can probably deduce that that money is in fact /isr profits. Now would this be a headache to process, to identify the "intangible" ECD earned from /isr? Yes. But it's probably still possible. (This also might be completely impossible and I don't know what I'm talking about. Is it not possible to use the logs in this way and write a script to identify /isr profits?) @314
I don't think that it would have to apply to all ECD, but applying a forced conversion to all ECD may be necessary to prevent the large influx of cash, assuming that this is the goal. It should also be noted that my main suggestion is not the implementation of these options, but rather that something be concretely decided on.
Maybe instead we should increase the number of ranks?!?! (EcoGod incoming?)
3) Nerfing /isr
4) Rich & Poor vs. Inflation Discussion
Also AdmiralD, I think the main concern of most players is not whether they will be able to grind as well but that the highest earners are concurrently those who spend USD (real money). Either that, or those who have grinded for many in-game hours and have gotten other people to buy things from Buycraft for them. Regardless, it's clear that the person who spends USD will spend less time grinding than the one who does not do so directly.
It's an issue that happened in old Main/Archive, but it's a two way street - we need things like Buycraft to help pay for server costs and maintenence.
5) Degree of Effects of Inflation (due to Forum Bank ECD)
Also concerning your point Mission, it still does not affect the economy at the same magnitude. Once you have inputted money into ranks, you cannot liquidate that money. Your rank is not an asset. Money thrown into the server, in the form of ranks or lost Sportsbook bets effectively removes it from circulation. -
- Withdrawing into Skyblock at a 1:10 conversion rate.
- /isr
- Withdrawing to the Archive server at a 1:1 rate.
- Depositing from the Archive server.
- Sending money to players with forum premium.
- Receiving money from other players.
- VMR prizes.
No, it's not possible.
Here's the most compact example I can imagine:
- You have $10 000, earned via the main server.
- I have $5 000, earned via /isr.
- I /pay you $5 000.
- You now have $15 000.
- You buy something from a player for $10 000.
- I no longer have the money. And even if I did, did I send you my main server money or my /isr money?
- You still have $5 000. Maybe you paid the player with your main server money?
- The player who received $10 000 could have received $5 000 Skyblock ECD from you. Or just $4 000. Or none at all!
It's not just difficult, it's not just a headache to do - it's impossible.
The only scenario where you could actually do this is if someone has never removed money from their bank balance and it's thus (easily) possible to determine how much they earned via ISR transfers (as all of the money is still in the same place). -
idkhowtoplay Custom Forum TitleBuilder ⛰️ Ex-EcoLegend ⚜️⚜️⚜️⚜️ Prestige ⭐ I ⭐ Premium Upgrade
So the only possibility left is to hard convert all pre-existing money to City. I assume this will not happen though. -
It's not realistically¹ doable, not even for a single player.
¹ I'm saying "realistically" because it is doable... if you make up many arbitrary rules and are willing to accept nasty consequences to the economy because almost any player on ECC would be affected by saying "A transferred money to B, who then transferred money to C, so let's decrease C's balance". -
Right now our decision is simply to enable bank withdraw after 12 months.
(I was going to go with 6 months, but I've changed my mind to the expanded time frame of 12).
Regarding nerfing ISR, as I have seen people discuss above, we will be nerfing it, however it will happen around season 3 or 4 (once our skyblock plugin is compatible with 1.13/1.14).
Feel free to suggest fresh ideas/topics after 8-10 months of City uptime, so we can rethink our game plan.-
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