Why is everyone concerned about "not making enough money"?

Kits have nothing to do with money, in fact, they're just to give an advantage in SG. Money ≠ Advantage. End of story.

Make it a kit free arena and let the kitters duke it out themselves.

 

But an advantage in SG increases profits.

 

Kits are for an advantage, not profit. Advantage ≠ Profit.

 

I regret buying my kits entirely as eventually I will end up with nothing.

 

THIS. THIS RIGHT HERE. YES.

 

Holy crap.

I look on this 'game' and see a bunch of people who 'play' the 'game' as if it's a job. It's almost like you guys are getting a lower salary in real life. People have got to stop treating this 'game' as life. If you're going to obsess over every single penny earned... get a real job.

 

lol

Exaggeration's an art.

an advantage leads to a higher chance of winning, which in the long run would increase profit, would it not?

That is one heck of a twisted view on the current situation. Do you seriously think they have that much power? Do you seriously think it the majority of the big SG players (who almost all have buffer) would be happy with an unbalanced gameplay? Or did you not notice the trend where suggestions were almost always written by people with said kits? Or are you just ignoring that for the sake of supporting your twisted logic?

People who used buffer were saying buffer had to be nerfed as well as people who didn't use buffer. I'd say that was a HUGE indicator that something wasn't right. That's because buffer got nerfed, not because some non-donators complained, it was exactly because the kit users complained. It was OP, unbalanced. Gamebreaking. You weren't playing a competetive game any more, you were slaughtering builders.
And even then it took a considerably long time for andrew to actually nerf buffer. (see andrew's post in this thread)

Anyway, the thought that because donators support the server financially they should get preferential treatment and a stronger voice is a twisted thought.
Or did you forget that you start out as a non-donator? Where do you think these donators come from? It's certainly not thin air. They're users. Users who are trying to have fun. If a user is chased away by a very OP buffer, how would that user ever donate? He would be long gone. Potential donator lost.
Cause and effect are a bit twisted up in your head.

 

Sure, but that's not the direct effect of buying a kit. It's just simply is an unintended benefit.

 

I'm trying to look at this through the eyes of a business owner. Let's say you own a new car company. You need people to buy your cars to stay in business. You sell very high-end racing cars that get tons of hp, more than any other car. Let's say 10 people pre-order your newest model. When they get their cars, they go and race them at a track. They win nearly every time. 7/10 of them complain that the car is too powerful and it shouldn't be able to race. Along with them, nearly every other racer who is always getting beaten complains that it is too powerful. Sometimes this car is beaten, but the majority of the racers believe the odds are greatly low for them to win. Now, you as the owner have to make a decision. Ask them to stop racing your car, ask them to send it in to have it's engine replaced with a less powerful version, or keep it as it is. You make the decision to replace the engines. Still, racers think it's too powerful even after it was debuffed. It's still winning often, but not as often. There is a more happy majority of racers, but a less happy majority of people who bought your car. You start to see sales of your car decrease. You think in the eyes of the buyer now, "Why should I pay more for a car that will eventually be equal to everyone else's?" If this persists and you keep on giving in, you'll lose your main source of income. You do have other models, but your most powerful and popular one is now being slowly destroyed. If you return the cars to their formal power, you'll get more sales and satisfied customers, but everyone who doesn't have one will hate you. If you keep it as it is, the complaining may stop or continue on and on until it is weakened again. The people who are criticizing you are not just people without great cars, it's also people with cars just below yours in power. So what's your decision?

In this case, Phy is the business owner. Buffer is the powerful car. The race track is SG. People who don't own a great car are the non-kitters. People with the cars just under the powerful car are people who have kits, but don't have buffer. People who have the car but don't like to be unfair with it are the people who own buffer but believe it needs nerfed.

The thing is, donation features aren't just about giving people advantages. If that was the case then why aren't they just handed out to random people for free? Donations are needed to keep the server going, or in the example, the company. SG I believe has become the biggest moneymaker in ECC. More than farming and mining. If we remove all kits or nerf them, you cannot expect other donations such as tp or ext commands to pick up for them. Donations other than kits are becoming less needed as the SG economy grows faster than mining/farming. Why would you need a tool repaired if you're just going to SG for money? Why would you want a pet if you're just going to be in SG all day?

The sad truth is, every free game has a price. I do believe donators are treated and should be treated with more respect then non-donators. If it wasn't for the donators, the non-donators wouldn't be playing ECC. Now, when donators criticize fellow donators for something they bought, thats just rude. If someone spent $90 on buffer++ and someone who spent $20 on tp tells them that buffer is unfair, maybe they should try making enough ecd to meet that or getting enough usd to spend $90 on a game. If someone who spent $100 on ext commands+ tells someone with buffer++ that it's unfair, maybe they should have used their to get buffer++ instead.

In the eyes of the server, a user who doesn't have any donations might as well be a dirt block. They're not doing them any good, not doing any harm. If you're a donator, the server sees you as potential so that it can go on. I was a non-donator at one point like you said. I saw the power of kits. I saw the advantages donators had over me. But that didn't scare me away, now did it?

Thank you.

 

Damn.

 

Don't - its a game for god sakes...

 

Comparing a pay2win scheme in a game (which can easily work without being unbalanced) to a car racing environment, where cars get exceedingly faster and more powerful, is a silly thing to do. If it were comparable then kits would become more powerful as time went on. But they don't, because it's a competitive GAME environment. (and my last paragraph)

"I was a non-donator at one point like you said. I saw the power of kits. I saw the advantages donators had over me. But that didn't scare me away, now did it? "

Mistake: Looking at this solely from your own point of view. Just because you weren't scared away doesn't mean others won't. You not being scared away is partially due to how you view kits and donations, which isn't necessarily a bad point of view, but it's not something most people have. I myself, as a kit user, literally quit SG due to buffer and spy. (and this was a long time ago, when the buffer and spy kit weren't even used much yet. I wouldn't play then, let alone now.) I have a bunch of kits, but not buffer or spy. This is because I honestly believe they're inbalanced.

Buffer and spy are like Formula 1 cars competing with regular cars (other kits/nonkits). Sure, the formula 1 car is comparatively more expensive, and they have more power and speed due to all the money and research that went into them, but that doesn't mean they can race against regular cars, because that would be unfair. They're a completely different class. They're regulated. If a formula 1 car were racing anyway people would be complaining, too!
Now, since this is a game the difference between buffer and the other kits isn't that massive, but it's still a gamebreaker. Or rather, was. Now it's a stopper, a kit that can be used to change the tide in a fight, but not necessarily strong enough to kill everyone in 1-2 hits.
I still believe spy is pretty unfair due to how many people don't have particles enabled because of lag. I'd like that one lowered to 1:30 as well, but I'm fairly content with the recent nerf so I'll leave the complaining to others.

 

@minecraftbros0 - To use your analogy, take a look at all of the restrictions in Formula 1. Sometimes all the cars being as fast as they possibly can be isn't a good thing.

 

Well it's more than a business than a game now. Phy needs money to keep the server up. Players have money. She just needs to convince the population to give her money to keep the server up. Same thing businesses do. Now, the biggest difference is that Phy doesn't pay her staff. But since they're volunteers, it's okay.
I'll get to everyone else's response after school.

 

Also, businesses aren't that simple. There are so many factors to take into account. You can't think of anyone who hasn't donated as people who will never donate. That's like me only catering to people who buy my product, no one else. Do you think Coca-Cola only sold to people who bought their product or do you think they go out and try to make sales to stores? You don't want to push away future money. I was a non-donator for well over half a year before i started donating. I ended up donated around $300. If I had played SG much, I definitely would have quit and never donated.

 

I don't think you understand. All money donated goes back into the server... Phys and andrew don't keep the money?

 

Phy has to pay for the computer that hosts the server, the website name, any taxes, and Internet. They may not keep any for themselves, but they need money to keep it up. Trust me, they are not cheap.

 

If donators had the same chance of non donators then why would you even donate? Buffer is strong, I know that. But it's also $90 for ++. That's a lot of money for an average person. By being strong it either makes you love it or hate it. Non-donators who see its power will either deal with it, leave, or buy it themselves if they have the money. You say it like everyone who is chased by buffer quits. If that's the case than why do people even have kits? By being powerful, either the good people stay or donators stay. If your not willing to put effort or money into sg, then leave sg and don't go back.

 

So if a Ferrari raced a Ford Taurus the Ford should win because it's slower? That's what I'm getting from what you're saying.

 

I don't understand why people discuss the finances of the server so much, however since I just received a curious PM (which I tend to get these once every few months by the curious ones) on the costs of running the server and getting angry at people labeling it a business I'll give you an example of what we pay for and some inside information for you on the aspects of running a big MineCraft server for several years:

- Server Machine (several thousand a year)
- Website Machine (several thousand a year)
- DDoS Protection (several thousand a year)
- Teamspeak Host (couple hundred a year)
- Spigot Sponsorship (several thousand a year)
- Development costs (several thousand a year)
- Advertising costs (thousands *beyond* thousands a year)
-- To expand on Advertising, when trying to get a top spot, I'm sadly competing with servers that have 20,000 players online (etc) that make several millions a year (yes this information has been leaked - couple servers I won't name but we all know who they are [one in specific] have showed profits of 30 million+ in one year; absolutely mind blowing isn't it) and here I am, having a hard time lately making this much. Now how much does advertising cost? Here's an example: 2 week slot - We're talking $2,000 - $4,000 for a simple two week period on one site, which I only pay for on various sites when I can afford.
- Many other costs (several thousand a year)

So for those wondering, yes, a big server can take a massive amount of money to run properly. As long as we are up, even during our current tough times, that's all that should matter. From our previous great year (2014) we have saved up quite a nice amount to be able to guarantee continued gameplay for quite a long while into the future. And that's how a server should be run. I know many owners who have dumped thousands of there earned dollars just to have to shut down their servers (literally spoken to them personally). I on the other hand won't do that, and even during our tough times, we will keep running, constantly, until the very last player gets bored <3. Example: Thanks to our wonderful savings account just paid $4,554 in advance to Intreppid so it's ready to be taken for our next billing cycle coming up in a few days: Payment

Also for those saying ECC shouldn't be run as a business, I'm sorry but what should it be run as, a hobby that you attend when you're bored? No, absolutely not, I'm sure many of our highest donators would disagree with that and expect the utmost professionalism from me when it comes to providing this gaming experience. Anything that costs tens of thousands a year, can, and absolutely should be treated as professionally as possible. Quality / Bug free / Stable game play is what I strive for, and if I wasn't treating this professionally we wouldn't have the environment we have now.

Anyways that's as much as I'm willing to go into regarding finances.

TL;DR: Running a server ain't free, and costs thousands beyond thousands to do so professionally.

PS: Have we made more than needed to run the server in 2014? Of course we did! Do we make anywhere near enough to finance everything we always have, including a sponsorship for Spigot, lately, not even close. Does it matter though? Nope. Do I ever ask for money because we may be struggling? Not a single time in 4 years. Why? Because savings =) ... I manage our finances and guarantee you we will stay up.