Pistons in the New 1.0

Discussion in 'Suggestions' started by Atroxkeep, Nov 25, 2011.

  1. Atroxkeep

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    Hello
    Im quite new to the server and was disappointed to find out that we could not use pistons. After a bit of time i realized why they were not on this server. The Dupe bug would destroy the entire economy in a very short time and no economy = a bad server that is based on an economy. I have been told of a few other things that the pistons can do that are not liked but that wont ruin the economy if it is enforced with the most strict rules.

    In the new minecraft 1.0 the dupe bugs have been solved and i know there are still a few issues with them. I think that the server will benefit more if they are put back to use, then if they were left out once again.

    I would suggest that if they are caught doing something that is deemed wrong and "illegal" by the server standards that they get a strict punishment. Im talking like 2+ weeks kick for first offence and if they do the same thing or any other wrong/"illegal" piston offence then they are banned.

    I would also suggest that you make it so pistons can only be placed by residents and above( or Mayor and above if you feel like you want even more added time in on the server for those who use pistons). You could also limit them to being able to only be placed in official towns.

    All I ask is that you take your time and look at all the angles and choose with a unbiased opinion on the possibility of allowing pistons to be allowed on the EEC server once again.

    Thanks for your time

    Atroxkeep
     
  2. Zeno78

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    No Pistons as far as i'm aware as there still is a dupe issues in 1.0.0
     
  3. Atroxkeep

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    Yes there is a dupe issue with paintings BUT you can not destroy the paintings to get sticks and wool so an easy fix for the server would be dont allow the selling of paintings....

    The sand and gravel dupe issue HAS been fixed in 1.0

    I personaly feel if pistons are left out because of a painting dupe ability that you are not letting the server use its full potential. You are also cheating the rest of us who like to make piston creations out of the full game expeariance.

    thanks again for your time

    Atroxkeep
     
  4. OctavianCloud

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    When the problems with pistons are fixed im sure andrew will allow them on the server again. Id rather not have lag from dupers and as someone who makes paintings to sell to the residents of my town for decorative purposes in their houses im against having anti selling for paintings. I understand you mean to the server but i base my prices off the server buy and sell prices so that would cause some problems for me keeping track of what paintings are selling to people for much like how diamonds are right now.
     
  5. CordialBacon

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    There is a redtorch dupe too, which could make people $$$$$....
     
  6. D0rc

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    There is a duplication bug with redstone.
    And I think there are others. Not just sand/gravel.
    It's not just the duplication bugs, though. Pistons can cause lag. Lots of lag if done just right. And I know of another bug that can completely crash servers, possibly corrupting the world.

    If you want to have pistons, at this rate, the only way they are coming anytime soon is to make them a donation feature, and set very strict rules on them. That's the only way I see them coming. And even then, I still find it unlikely, as setting rules on them isn't enough, you need to make sure the rules are followed, and it's really hard to tell if someone has a duplication thing set up, we would have to look at the entire world for these things, top to bottom...

    Pistons probably won't come unless Notch completely 100% fixes them, and that could be months from now, maybe even longer.
     
  7. Atroxkeep

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    Im sure the redstone dupe was fixed a long time ago... i will double check when i get back home and have the ability to look at sites when there not blocked by the work internet.

    I can build massive redstone circuits thats basicly a computer and i can lag down the server too but redstone is not blocked.... I know there are many other ways of lagging a server down but i think you might get one eprson who is mad at the server who will try this. catch him and ban him. It wont be a small setup if hes trying to lag the server it will be noticable.

    All the reasons im hearing (other then the duplication ones which im very sure have all been fixed with the new 1.0.0) dont really justify the banning of pistons from the server. Yes limitations will need to be made and there will have to be goals reached befor you can use them. But to just take the cheap and easy route of banning them is wrong and it should be looked at. Maybe even voted on by the mods and maybe even presidents and mayors of the server AFTER they have all been briefed on the current minecraft 1.0.0 piston abilities and not the bugs that existed in older versions. thats like going with a MAC and not windows 7 because windows vista was too buggy. Because all im seeing is people telling me about piston bugs from older versions of minecraft that have now been fixed.
     
  8. MsMoofin

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    How can you know all bugs with pistons are fixed on 1.0.0? You can't, really... Especially with multi-player servers. Bukkit is not in a safe, updated state yet. Plugins could interfere with pistons, or Bukkit itself. And I'm doubting all bugs are fixed, to be honest... Bugs tend to be found when they already cause tons of damage.

    We do not need lag issues, either. It would ne impossible to find who is causing lag with pistons and where. Pistons are usually hidden. We cannot just see them in-game or on the live map. If one person goes and lags the server with them, they will be taken out. Period. Would completely ruin the fun for those who were not causing trouble. Bad influences and choices seem to spread with the troll-y / "playful" members.

    Redstone may cause lag, but you cannot buy the materials for redstone, you must farm it. No one wants to spend time farming tons and tons of redstone just to lag the server...

    Severe punishments just wouldn't work. A serious, well-known, veteran player could make something amazing with pistons, cause the server to lag, and we could ban simply because we thought they were trolling or something. They may not have been, and telling them to take down their hard work would be a pain and upsetting. :/

    Pistons in-general seem like a pain, one way or another. I'd love to see people make piston creations, but until there is a sure-fire safe way to implement them, I'd rather not see them at all. Seems like a hassle for Andrew and everyone else. ._.
     
  9. CordialBacon

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    I just tested redstone dupe glitch, seems to be fixed.
     
  10. D0rc

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    This right here. This still exists in 1.0.0. I've encountered it in RC2 I believe. (RC2 being EXACTLY like the current 1.0.0) There is no way we are letting this into a big server like this one.

    You can build "massive redstone circuits" that lag a server. What kind of server? It's hard to lag a server like this one. But pistons can still lag it.
    Pistons do so many things: Update blocks around them, have an animation, move two (Three?) piston blocks onto another block, plus the block being pushed, make a sound, activate when redstone hits it, and are a completely different block type/entity than any other thing in thing in the game, (Who knows what problems that could cause.)

    Redstone does lots too, but nothing nearly as bad: Lights up (Causing block updates.) Gives power to things, as well as takes power from things. (Probably just as bad as reacting to redstone.) and...other stuff (Doesn't move blocks though.)

    The point I'm trying to make here is that pistons can cause tons of lag, not even looking at my assumptions, it's been proven that they cause so much more than a simple redstone thing that lights up. So they can lag any server. As well, they are much more likely to cause chunk errors that could also cause severe lag.

    Another thing, pistons can not be found easily, someone could have a lag generator underground, and nobody will notice.
    Example: Lag? Where is it coming from? Is it a chunk error? Am I going to have to dig out the entire underground to find this piston if it even is one? Or have Andrew waste his time to check if it's just a chunk error?

    As a Minecraft nerd (Everyone says I'm apparently super smart with Minecraft stuff, I don't know why <_<) I know that not all duplication issues have been fixed. In 1.7.3 (Or 1.7.2, I can't remember.) Notch said duplication issues had been fixed, however, none were at all. I've read things all over the place, saying that Notch said that he has sense, not tried to fix any issues until 1.0.0 now, in which, all he fixed was the sand/gravel, there are several people who I know that have said there are still issues, people that have played 1.0.0, and are saying there are still issues because they played with pistons.

    Also, MoofinK's post.
     
  11. Immaculata

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    As far as I know duping and crashing the server requires the use of sticky pistons as well as normal pistons.

    Why don't you simply enable one and not the other? Ie; let us have pistons and not sticky pistons, or let us place sticky pistons and not normal pistons ... pistons are a huge part of the minecraft experience ... building machines is the practical evolution of farming, surviving in the wild, this much is evident from all the games that Minecraft copied to come up with it's *cough* original idea.
     
  12. MsMoofin

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    I think an issue of, "You have this piston, why not this one!? I CAN'T MAKE WHAT I WANT, ADD THE OTHER PISTON!!!!!!" would come up a lot. Would bring even more questions to be answered, and people just wouldn't understand why we chose for only one piston to work. :/
     
  13. Immaculata

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    Well it is the middle ground between the two issues, if they cannot understand why ECC only allows one piston, then they really should perhaps go back to school rather than playing Minecraft all day. I would believe that the majority of people would want sticky pistons to make secret doors and passages etc ... normal pistons are only really used for infinate cobblestone generators (ie, making a self building wall/floor), otherwise imo, for everything else sticky pistons suffice.